While the talking heads in business news are chattering on about market downturns, inflation, and the potential for another recession, focusing too much on such negative things can kill your sales results.
On the other hand, if you are unprepared, real-world conditions can bite you when you least expect it!
As a business leader, how can you find the right balance to ensure that your sales efforts become and remain recession-proof?
On this episode of Evolved Sales LIVE, host Jonathan Fischer sits down with expert sales coach and consultant, Meghann Misiak, to discuss the exact steps B2B SaaS companies can take to reduce sales cycles, increase close rates, and grow their average deal size – regardless of market conditions.
Don't forget to follow us on LinkedIn for more engaging sales insights and discussions! Happy watching!
Meet Meghann:
Meghann Misiak is an expert sales coach and sales training consultant, with a special focus on helping B2B SaaS companies boost the performance of every member of their sales teams to elite status.
Check out the transcription of the conversation below!
Jonathan Fischer 0:04
Welcome back. Thanks for joining us. I'm Jonathan Fisher. Well, it's happening again, the talking heads in business news are chattering on about market downturns inflation, the potential for another recession, et cetera. Well, our guest today states that with the right strategies in place, you can make your sales team recession proof, able to perform in any market conditions. Megan Misiak is an expert sales coach and consultant with a history of helping b2b companies boost each and every member of their sales team to elite level of performance. And our talk today, Megan will share the exact steps you can implement to reduce sales cycles, increase close rates and boost average deal size in any market conditions. Megan, fantastic to have you on the show today. Welcome.
Meghann Misiak 0:48
Thanks so much for having me.
Jonathan Fischer 0:50
So by way of introduction, Megan, these insights about building a recession proof team, I'm gonna wager did not come to you automatically. Tell us just a little bit about how you came across the insights you'll be sharing with our listeners today.
Meghann Misiak 1:04
Yeah, so for me, I think that it's interesting. When we, whether it's sales leaders or salespeople, some of us are going through our very first kind of shift in the market. You know, a lot of the people that I've been talking to, it is their their first time dealing in an unhealthy market. And it's interesting, because a lot of us haven't realized how healthy of a market we've been in. And so when COVID hit I personally, that every smartest man in the room, and I'm like, Okay, this is, you know, for me one of the biggest kind of catastrophes that I've dealt with business wise. So I went to a lot of other mentors and people who had been through other market chips, and asked for some help. So excited to tell us to share a few things that worked for me in previous companies. But I do think the cool part of this is, it's kind of why I got into sales training, because I really wanted to learn how to sell in any environment, I wanted to learn how to be as good as I could, I didn't want to ever settle for, you know, good enough selling. And I think the kind of ironic, optimistic view here is that we really are being pushed to do to do the best we can for ourselves for our clients. And this challenge is also a huge opportunity to, to learn new strategies and to build new skills that sales sellers and sales leaders and sales teams can use even in healthy markets.
Jonathan Fischer 2:43
Well, and I love that your your first thought is already one key insight, and that is that sometimes the markets better than you think it is, right? Sometimes it's just, it's just, it's chattering on it's the talking heads have to keep things rolling. And in reality, your market is what your market is. And a lot of a lot of that is what you make of it. That said, it's well to be well prepared. I mean, sometimes if you don't think about these things, that can also be a big issue, because then it can kind of bite you and you're not ready for it. So I'm excited that we're going to be sharing with your listeners ways that they can do just that they can be well prepared in advance. By the way, a friendly reminder to our live audience. Being here live has a lot of advantages, not the least of which is you can have your questions answered right here by the expert. When we get to the bottom of the half hour here. We're going to revert over to a q&a as our customers here on evolve sales live. Don't wait for the end. Go ahead and put your questions in chat right now. Well, thank those. And we'll come back to those at the end. So Megan, if you would lead off, tell us a little bit about what what are some of the biggest issues you're seeing with sales teams, perhaps by way, like, let's let's talk about the gap before we start to fill in other words, like where our teams find themselves flat footed when working conditions make sudden shifts?
Meghann Misiak 3:54
So I love this question. And my answer actually goes back to something you said earlier, which is that a lot of times I see sales leaders trying to pretend like everything's fine. This actually comes from a lot of sales sellers that I talked to I also do individual sales coaching. And sometimes I hear you know, my sales leader is just acting like these numbers are okay, or, you know, kind of placing the blame on the Deville ship individual salespeople. And for me, the first step is just awareness. It is being 100% transparent with you with the team. And I think that this is hard for sales leaders, because we want to be positive, and we don't want to create fear. And if you look at the average tenure of sales leaders, there's unfortunately there is a lot of other pressure that gets added to sales leaders even more so than the normal so you also want to you know, you want to be positive for investors. But for me when we think about just getting aware of where you are where you stand, it can have provide that that agility, you know, the the ability to work really quickly to. I love what you said earlier, like find the opportunity here because the market may be bad for some clients, but not for others. So there are three questions I would ask in terms of really getting aware. The first one, how are your clients doing? And by the way, that's a little bit of a nuanced question, because a lot of times different clients are doing differently, right. So one thing I always recommend is really thinking about like, of your territory of the prospects of your current clients, you know, who may need a little bit more support, who may be really struggling? Are there actually some industries or some types of clients that may be thriving, that actually might have additional budget. And so getting really clear, there can be very helpful in terms of knowing where you want to focus your energy and knowing that you might have to do a little bit of hard work, right, and like reprioritizing, territory, rethinking about different clients, and also thinking about the value props, you know, it might be a, it might be a little bit more around security and stability. You know, rather than previously it was about growth and, and revenue. So definitely like the what the first question is, you know, how are my clients doing? And I'm curious how how you have used it. Have you ever seen that? The How do you think about that shift?
Jonathan Fischer 6:33
Yeah, well, what I like about that is, it gets us out of the trap of worrying about our position in a market that's shifting, right. If as sales professionals, our goal should be to serve that client. And so if we are thinking about what's going on with them, we've already done ourselves a big favor, as opposed to, you know, what are you going to do now? Well, what you're going to do now is continue to serve clients in a way that makes the most sense with what's happening in reality with them. And you may find out some of them are they're, they're buying up what looks bad in the news might be an opportunity for them, you don't know. And now there's a maybe it's time to push the pause button. I really liked that you basically what you what I'm hearing in a nutshell is, hey, just just let's just take a sensible look at this thing is like a real analysis of what's actually happening instead of being just emoting based on what we're being told by, again, those Talking Heads, I'm gonna, they're gonna come in for a lot of abuse, I think in this particular show that chattery heads, because they don't maybe serve us very well, on this particular issue. Would you agree?
Meghann Misiak 7:29
Absolutely. And I do think that that also relates to not only your clients, but to salespeople. I think that a lot of times we are, you know, just any shift in anything in a process, the market territories, even just simple policies, even where you know, like what coffee you serve in your office, if you still have an office, you know, salespeople are going to have reactions. But you know, I do think the the second question we need to ask ourselves in terms of awarenesses, how are my sellers doing, and not only sentiment, but especially right now, I think that there, I've been working with Andy Paul, partnering on a coaching program. And one thing he talks about constantly is win rate. And how we are pretty predictable in terms of you know, a lot of times forecast accuracy, and things like that, in terms of predicting that we don't very have very high win rates. And what I mean by that is, you know, just the number of deals that we win versus lose. And so for me, it has been a huge opportunity to look at different metrics, I think so many times, because a lot of times like the industry averages are very low. In the deals that we're winning, we have to bring on more pipeline. And one thing I hear constantly right now is pipeline is not it's like nowhere to be found. Let's be real, like I said in the previous question, when we do think about, you know, updating value props, making sure we're targeting the right people that can be impacted. But I do think that right now, it's a huge opportunity, and almost a little bit of a necessity to really focus on the sales process. Really, you know, going a little bit slower, making sure that we're actually helping our buyers understand the shifts. Because one part of that understanding how your clients are doing is knowing that in markets like this, what typically happens is there's not as much budget overall, right? So there's not going to be as much opportunity for a nice to have options. No one likes to think that they're nice to have, but a lot of times we you know, we're moving a little bit too fast with a sales process. And so even just thinking about overall deal health. One of the things that I do for clients is implement a framework called medic, which is essentially like a deal scorecard, making sure that we're not just rushing through every opportunity because we have fewer of them But we're actually leveraging a lot of strategy to make sure we're uncovering pain. And again, make sure we have a really good understanding, we're not making any assumptions, even for existing clients about what the budget process is what approval process looks like. And, again, some of those changing value props, right, they may be dealing with different things or trying to achieve different things. The buying process may be completely different than even the previous year. And I think that when it comes to mapping back to that question of how are my sales salespeople doing? It really comes back to us trying to not just add more and more and more pipeline and salespeople and strategies and like, and even just, you know, try to get more pipeline try to get more prospects? I do you think that it, it's not sustainable. And I think that right now, in a bad market, it's a huge opportunity to do things a little bit differently, to focus on, you know, higher win rates, better performance per sales people sales person. And, as all hopefully, we have a lot of salespeople on the phone as well, this is a huge opportunity to lean into your own, you know, investing in your own strategies as well.
Jonathan Fischer 11:23
Well, and I think when there's not quantity, this is a chance to focus on quality. And but that does take a very clear process to go through and talk about that, that the deal health as you refer to it, let's really know what we have, what is the actual status of our pipeline? Does that actually put a little bit more pressure? Do you think on management to kind of get involved with that then and kind of work through one by one? Hey, let's take it let's let's really get into this pipeline, one by one with your people. Is that sort of a given?
Meghann Misiak 11:55
I don't know you would think it would be right. But I think that I'm like, I don't want to say it, but I'm gonna say it. So what I typically see is even more micromanagement, at times like this, managers are stretched thin, they have more pressure on themselves. And a lot of times they they don't know how to do it that, you know, they don't have to do it either. So I do think that there is a for me, how I would be thinking about it as both a sales leader and a sales person is knowing that what worked for you previously, maybe you know, how you got into sales leadership, how you got into, you know, a high level sales role, it might not work. And so I do think there's a little bit of a plateau for some people, especially those natural salespeople, in terms of it is a hard market, and it is going to be a lot harder to build business cases to allocate budget to know what clients are struggling with. But you know, even being smarter, not even smarter, but like, you know, helping your clients anticipate the challenges they may have as well, before they even know it. So I do think that this for me is where really that leveling up happens. And it's strategy, right? It's better understanding like getting even better at understanding the buying process. Understanding gain, pain, building strong champions, multi threading is all these things that are buzzwords in sales training, right. But I do think that it right now a lot more people, both sales leaders and sales people are coming to me as a trainer saying, hey, like I even I had a prospect from huge, huge sales company went through a lot of layoffs. One thing I heard was, I just had someone who got laid off, and their performance wasn't terrible. I think there's also just a, you know, this overall, kind of shows that like even if you have a job and one of the top sales teams in the world, it's like, you know, really popular and is known for their training. Good enough isn't good enough anymore.
Jonathan Fischer 14:14
Got to be ready for those changes. So we're working our way through what it's turning out to be the Miss shack AAA method of building a recession proof team. I'll bill you for that later. But so we got awareness. This is where we start. What else do we need to be doing in this this awareness phase of your, your approach here?
Meghann Misiak 14:34
Yeah, so if that was a little bit more, you know, hypothetical reflective. I mean, I think it's the number one thing right, but once we know a little bit, you get that that awareness. We can do we can take some actions. So I want to get pretty tactical here. I did get out some ideas. You know what I've seen work previously as well as just some ideas for really like getting creative with some of these things. things. And I do want to highlight, you know, in awareness is also just an inherent vulnerability. Again, I think that salespeople and sales leaders, we don't want to admit that we don't know, we don't have all the answers, we don't know sometimes how to move forward. But even just admitting that can be can open a lot of conversations. So even some of my actions are continuing on that thread of vulnerability. But you know, the first thing that my last full time role when when COVID hit, what we did was we, we actually added a category in Salesforce in our CRM, that was COVID impact. And this was our sales ops team, they did an incredible job literally categorizing every single prospect based on it went from it was like three or four fields of like, highly impacted, okay, negative impact from COVID, or positive impact. And we actually recalibrated our entire territory, you know, like, probably about 2000 prospects based on that. But I think the overall thing is like, again, reassessing who makes a good target and why changing your value pops, changing your messaging, getting ahead of it, you know, not just saying, Hey, how are you, you know, just checking in and like, basically just waiting for everyone to be like, I'm so sorry, everything's on pause. But literally like becoming the person they go to. Because you're actually giving the you're ahead of it, right? You're saying, Hey, here's three things we're hearing from our clients in this space, happy to talk you through this happy to tell you a little bit of what we're seeing in the field and how you can anticipate these things and work through them. And overall, even having events like that, right. Like, I think the second leading into one of my second tips is becoming an expert. And I know it's hard, because people are like, I don't know what's happening. But when you can really, you know, get ahead of it become an expert in terms of the market shifts, all these things, even when I say become an expert, even just sharing, Hey, these are three things I've heard from the last three clients that I've spoken with. These are the things they're worried about this, these are the things they're thinking through. And these are some of the ways that they've struggled to get this project done. Because ultimately, you have to remember that like your client, they want to get it done too. So even you sharing what has been a struggle for other clients, right, whether that's getting access to budget, whether it's, Hey, like, we got to the final stages, and they said that they actually had like three additional steps that my champion didn't know about. So I'm curious, maybe we can check in with your team. And just make sure, you know, our budgets, still on track, has anything changed and approval process, just asked me some of those questions. And again, getting ahead of it can actually really continue to build the trust with the clients, because they're probably freaking out just as much as we are as salespeople if not more.
Jonathan Fischer 18:03
Yeah. One thing I love about that, too, you mentioned Andy Paul, he was on the show just a few weeks ago, our conversation was around, in part, at least why a lot of our buyers don't want to talk to salespeople. Yeah, laugh, but it's kind of not funny. But that also kind of is one of the reasons that St. Paul points this out very succinctly is that you're not offering value. Like in our busy day, if someone is on my phone, does your art it's already as distraction, that's a given. You're also not adding value, it goes to, like, for on zero to 10 level of I want to get rid of you, it goes to 10 I want to get rid of you, right? Suppose if you're adding value, maybe it's 10. Hey, I'd love to listen to you. And if you really embrace what you were just sharing, yeah, that's, that's very powerful insight.
Meghann Misiak 18:49
Yeah, and I'll give you a you know, just a, whether a sales leader or a sales person, one of the things that, you know, I use, it is a framework called medic. And by the way, so down here, like, I don't know what medic is, what it is, is how do I say this? It actually is a framework that was built in the 90s by a tech company for elite enterprise deals, and actually is just an acronym that represents every single element in any enterprise deal. So its metrics, economic buyer decision criteria, decision process identified pain champion and competition. And you're like, Wow, that's a pretty complex. Well, yeah, if you're selling complex deals. For me, I gotten into sales training because I was doing okay. But I wasn't doing as well as I want it to. And so for me, having, you know, a checklist that I can literally work through with my clients to say, Hey, okay, so like, you know, how have, how do I have a Do we have a really good understanding of what they're trying to achieve, how they're measuring it. And it also is there was good opportunity to challenge yourself to say have I actually like checked all of these boxes, not only for me as a salesperson to win the deal. But again, like, the ironic thing that I think a lot of salespeople forget is that if you've actually tapped into what your clients want, they want to get the project done, aka the deal close as much as you do. And so for me, when I do these checklists, what it helps with is, before each meeting, I'm literally doing this checklist to see what me and my champion need to complete in order to build their understanding of the problem, to help them understand, you know, what they should be thinking about what they should be looking for what's important to them. But more importantly, the cool part of that is that usually at the end of every call, I'm like, Hey, so how are you feeling? What are you concerned about? What questions do you have? And then, you know, go into little spiel. And usually I say, Hey, so, you know, I know that you want to get this done, I know that this is really important to you to solve, can I just share a few things I'm a bit worried about at this stage. And clients reaction, they're like, what, you know, you're not just a normal salesperson who's like, yeah, everything's great. Let's put the next meeting, let's get 25 people on it, you know, there really, again, it goes back to that awareness, being really aware of what your gaps are in this deal and working with your, your client to actively solve them. For me, this is what is going to really make the difference between good sellers and great sellers. And I'll give you a you know, quick example of that. So for me, and one of my deals, because I use, I use, I'm actually a rare medic trainer that actually uses medic in my own sales process. But I was going through, you know, one of my largest deals, and we I mean, we had built the business case, so collaboratively. Um, I described myself as a collaborative seller, we had built it so collaboratively, and you know, it was like 15 pages long, and it was really extensive. And, you know, I, my champion, were there, like, we are good to go. All we need to sign off from the CRO. And I was like, okay, so you know, personally, I'm super thankful for all the work we've done together, I feel really confident in what we put together, I do have a few concerns, can I share those. And I think one of them was that I personally had not met the CRO so I was like, you know, one, one of the ways that I've seen deals fall through is if the CRS sees this, and it's not in his language, it's not mapping to like his pet projects that, you know, he has to report on to the investors. Maybe he doesn't know as much of the pain that we have listed here. So I really want to challenge us, you know, are there any more any final opportunities for us to, you know, go through this and really make it more centric to his goals? Also, actively challenging them and saying, Hey, like, these are the three objections you're probably going to get from him? How much how soon and how sure. I just want to go through and you know, you're probably going to get these from him. If I if I'm on the call, or maybe outside of a call with me. How well do you feel like you're able to answer those questions? And third, for me, it's always like, Is anyone else potentially involved that we haven't talked to, you know, your tech team, your sales operations, you know, like anyone who could derail this, because I've seen it literally take weeks longer, if we don't, you know, think of those people and getting them involved a little bit earlier. And so like, those are three big objections, and I'll be honest, two of them, they were like, hey, actually, we literally just sold another deal. We got it through there weren't any, you know, other people involved. We have already, you know, checked with them, etc. But there wasn't there was a big one with this era where they're like, actually, you're right. Maybe we can just bring you into meeting with him. Just to make sure like every answer can be every question to be answered. So again, like getting that level of it brings in awareness, but also brings in that strategy and really knowing again, Where do I stand and not only Yeah, we can probably get this deal done without these it might not be an issue, but proactively bringing those things up for me like anxiety is my superpower in sales, and it works now better than ever.
Jonathan Fischer 24:46
Well, I love that because you're really positioning yourself as a true adviser like that. Confidence is the number one factor in making deals close versus not closed, like your confidence level. We don't I think most of us know that. But how calm often it does that, how much confidence does that project when you kind of are coming out of that way? It also seems more like a servant oriented angle as opposed to a self serving angle. There's a lot to recommend that. So tell us a little bit more about that. How can you actually, you know, this, I'm sure a lot of our listeners, this is a new methodology, where would they go to find out more about that?
Meghann Misiak 25:23
Yeah, so um, I actually, I am a medic trainer, I do work with organizations too, whether it's, you know, doing medic trainings, helping you create a custom scorecard. I also do group coaching. So I'm doing a program launching in q2 for any sellers or small sales teams that you know, want to do group training on this framework. But I actually give away my medic, deal scorecard for free. So it is a literally checklist you answer questions, it is a template, so it might not be 100% relevant, or feel free to make a copy, make it yours. But what I find is that even just going through the questions, usually people come to me and they're like, is this what I'm supposed to be doing in the sales process, because I'm not doing a lot of this. So it is a huge reflection, you know, in terms of that awareness in terms of, you know, what you might be doing, but also most of the time, people have some of those like, Oh, no moments, where they're like, Wow, I have a huge amount of opportunity to to grow, I'm not doing well enough in this area. So it's a great, you know, free resource to help you with your self awareness. Also really good for teams. You know, whether it's like using a deal scorecard in a team exercise, and saying, Hey, so like, Thanks for one of the volunteers. And when those salespeople let's go through this, let's see, what can we do to strengthen this deal. And also, one of the cool parts about the spreadsheet is that it's actually even gives you a populates a deal health score, which is definitely something that I think that sales team should really think about implementing, I know that it you know, is a little bit more complex, and might be a little bit more advanced strategy. But again, on top of winrate, really making sure that each deal is healthy that you've answered, why change why you why now effectively is critical, especially when we got fewer ops, and we have to focus on quality over quantity.
Jonathan Fischer 27:30
Well, I love that resource. And I know you have one more offering where they share with the listener. But before we do that, give us 60 seconds, if you would on your third day of the three, you mentioned, awareness and action, and agility was the third a in the Miss check, triple A methodology here. So tell us a little bit more about that in 60 quick seconds.
Meghann Misiak 27:51
Yeah. So for me, you know, when I look at sellers, as well as sales leaders who really excel not only in short term, but long term, you know, you can give me a natural salesperson with natural skills. But personally, I prefer the person who is constantly learning, they never, you know, assume anything, they're constantly growing, constantly evolving. They're working through their comfort zones. And I think that that skill really shines right now. So for me agility, it really means both at a team level and as a, at a salesperson level. You know, it's asking for help, it's being vulnerable, it's truly seeking to understand not just to do and so one also idea that I have for really like addressing agility at a team wide level is, it is a cool opportunity to ask your team to practice agility. So one idea we can do is actually have a hackathon, where we're, you know, you're saying like, Hey, these are the three biggest issues we are facing right now. Like who has ideas, and asking your team to come up with ideas to help you solve these problems, getting them, you know, encouraging innovation, encouraging agility, getting new ideas, and also, as a sales leader, you know, getting everyone to literally be bought into change and ideas and new projects can be incredibly effective for actually managing some of that change.
Jonathan Fischer 29:21
I love that. So I love the action orientation that's come out in our conversation today, Megan, and it's gone by way too quickly. I know our listener would love to take things further. Let's take full advantage of the medic deal scorecard. You have one other really interesting offering for the listener to go further with your insights. What What was that that you were talking to me about earlier?
Meghann Misiak 29:41
Yeah, so I'm on my website. I actually have virtual coffee signups. So whether you're a sales leader, even salespeople, I'm always willing to meet with people. I have, you know, a few hours every week. So if you want to pick my brain if you want to geek out on sales, if you want to learn a little bit more about how you can really, you know, work through performance plateaus. Or if you want to, of course, like talk about, you know, training for your team, or how to really build agility and, and help your team through this challenging market, feel free for you to book a 30 minute virtual coffee with me. So thanks for linking that.
Jonathan Fischer 30:23
Yeah, I love that. So we're about to go ahead and Veer over into our q&a, I do want to flash a brief graphic on the screen, this medic methodology is a pretty fascinating approach to doing an analysis of your deal health and being well prepared for any market conditions or shifts that might come up. We'll put that on the screen for your for our LinkedIn live audience members also replay audience members that will be looking at this in weeks to come. But it is now time we're gonna go over to Q and A, and get some real time answers from our expert. On tab. We'll take a look here and see what we've got. So one LinkedIn user is asking this question, Megan, do you feel it could be to seller focus, I guess, is there a caveat with applying this methodology? This medic even though it's thoroughly organized for the process? I guess you can you can do it wrong. Maybe talk talk to us about how you how you can this can be a misfire if you don't go about it the right way.
Meghann Misiak 31:18
I'm so glad that this question was brought up because when I say my medic trainer, people are always like a another framework that, you know, I would say there's a probably two biggest complaints about medic. One is that it is seller centric, to that it is almost too complex. So I'm glad that this one was brought up. Because, yes, I absolutely agree that one of the biggest challenges that I actually worked through with organizations as well as individuals is making it buyer centric. So I hope that even the way that you know I was talking through the way that I use a very collaborative sales process shows you how I've almost like given medic, a little bit of a refresh to make it more read by or specific. So a very quick example here is and by the way, I'm actually working with a partner, I don't want to release the details yet, though, we're actually going to be releasing medic paired with another framework and it like completely revamping medic later this year. But um, I'll give you one example. So within medic, even in my scorecard, I have, have you collaborated with your champion to build a mutual action plan that, you know, helps them like get this deal done by the time like have their compelling event. And like that is very like salesy in terms of the internal, you know, jargon and everything. But I also do believe that that's why medic coaching and Medic training and really working with you to make sure that we're consistently in the clients mindset is important.
Jonathan Fischer 33:05
Yeah, I love that. Well, I mean, frameworks, if so, people do sometimes roll their eyes at them, right, I get that. But hey, we're talking about a recipe really, I don't think it was a recipe I enjoy cooking is as a bit of a hobby. And I like to have a good recipe, I want to riff on that recipe, it's doubtful I'm gonna follow it to a tee. But I like having that starting point, it still gives me some guidance, maybe even comparing recipes, last may feel a little more confident with my own intuitions on that dish. And I kind of see, you know, we're cooking up a better approach here in a way. And a good framework is like a good recipe. For what it's worth. That's my two cents. What do you think making
Meghann Misiak 33:43
100%. And there's actually a reason why my medic scorecard is like, is a Google document. Because I'm constantly evolving it. And I will say that people like a strategy, people use it for good, they can use it for evil when I am joking when I say for evil, but I do think that humans are a really good example. Because that's usually why I work with organizations like longer term and work with, you know, individual salespeople, usually for like, a year or two, at least because even when you're trying to implement something like a mutual action plan, it it takes a lot to make it client centric to work through some of the kinks there in terms of like, you know how you're positioning it and I will say that this outside of medic the number one thing that I challenge people on the salespeople I work with organizations is taking it out of this is what I need to do to get the deal done and more so around that's why I actually like the idea of deal health because it's how can I need enable my champion to buy from me, right? Like, how can I enable them to get this project done to see the most value to streamline the entire experience, because your champion is the internal salespeople, your salesperson, like people forget that it's not you against your champion, it should be you and your champion, partnering to get everyone else on board with it. Sometimes even your sales leader, right, we can use a strategy called othering. But I think that like one of the biggest things for me is helping salespeople truly put themselves on the same side of the table. And to your point, Medic, it is only a recipe, right? For me medic is like a checklist. It actually when you know, as a sales trainer, also, why give away this for free is that medic doesn't tell you like how to get it done, right? It just exposes the things that you may not have checked off yet. So with any framework checklist, anything like this, I think that this is probably the biggest challenge that salespeople have is putting yourself on the same side of the table is your buyer, and truly being client centric. And like I said, for me, the way I've done this is, is what I call collaborative selling, even when I do pricing. I actually like don't call them like proposals or leaving I actually say as a pricing workshop. So there's a lot of really cool ways I think that, you know, I've also been learning and implementing and trying to make it more client centric.
Jonathan Fischer 36:39
It makes a lot of sense. I like that sometimes just changing the nomenclature can make a big difference. It changes your mindset language is critical. Yeah. So here's a good question, too. This is kind of coming maybe from the opposite. We were talking about having a carefully constructed, you know, line by line approach. Well, here comes a new player in the space of selling, he says, or at least at least has a new product, excuse me, I don't know, Jordan, if you're new or not forgive me. But you have a new product where you have a huge pricing advantage. And right now, their approach is to play that up. Hey, we're only 8% of what you're spending right now. He's having some success. Could you share some of your general thoughts on that as a strategy
Meghann Misiak 37:19
overall? Okay, so I'm so interesting, because I definitely see some teams where cost is the main driver. But what that fails to recognize is the cost of change. People forget that it's not just like, I mean, I have not I kind of like, do a different type of phone than an iPhone. Like I really liked the camera on the Samsung. Why have I not switch from an iPhone? Because it would take hours to change over the technology? Yeah, even though there's benefits, even though it's literally cheaper. And I think I know, that's a silly example. But that's what we as sellers forget, we think that it's literally just the cost of the technology. We don't think about the the cost in by the way, cost is more than money. It's more than revenue. It's, there's so many but a few ideas here. What are you actually thinking about? Is there any value? Right? They they actually might think, okay, cool, this is cheaper. But if you actually position yourself as cheaper, they might think of you as less valuable, literally is less valuable, right? Like, is it a an apples to apples comparison, because they probably don't trust that they might actually see the the negative cost would be losing features losing functions, and they might not even for them, trust themselves enough to even like be able to truly assess that. There's also for them, if they switch and it doesn't go well, there's reputational cost. Yeah, there's performance cost. Also, I have tried to implement a new system or just change systems. There's also just the logistical nightmare of doing so what are you going to lose in terms of data? What are you going to lose in terms of, you know, data in terms of even just like people not using it adoption, because people are used to using a software, right? So I do think that you're only selling based on cost. And literally, like contract cost, it really is limiting yourself because you're not recognizing the full spectrum of what people kind of consider in terms of, you know, cost versus value, as well as the broader cost of making a change.
Jonathan Fischer 39:48
Well, and I agree 100% Megan, I think underpricing can sometimes be an even worse mistake than than being too expensive for your marketplace. That's an easy adjustment to bake. Oh, well. Okay, we'll work something out. You can either add value or work on the pricing. If you're coming in too low, those perceptional shifts are much more difficult to overcome. Probably that means that part of your work, Jordan, if I may add, is to make it easy, like, make it clear. And that sounds like your CRM. So yes, it's not going to be quite as difficult with that as maybe some other solutions, but still gotta remember those other costs were to reckon with those and be ready, because maybe some of your biggest, biggest accounts are going to be most concerned with with some of these issues. Again, another listener here that has a really great name, his name is Jonathan. And he's asking, What do you recommend about ghosted leads? And you know, I mean, gosh, when times get rough, that's, that's where I mean, as a manager and business owner, myself, I'm thinking, Yeah, let's go. Well, we already have let's, you know, every resource, let's let's get this look down through these lists, let's pull them up, pull them together. What is there a little bit of juice in this lemon? What are your thoughts on that? Yeah, so
Meghann Misiak 40:56
I do weekly coaching for, actually, for sales leaders, as well as for founders. And this is I feel like it comes up every time, especially on this, this time of year comes around, like every few weeks. So my always consistent go to tips here. First, stop checking in, no one cares about, you know, checking in, you know, just seeing how things are going lead with value. So, one of the ways that I like to, you know, bring this back up is to say, Hey, I wanted to, you know, I know that this was really important to you, this thing, I knew that when we last spoke, these were the three things that you were extremely focused on. I know that things may have shifted, you know, for me, typically, it's for one of these three reasons. One, maybe the timing is not right, maybe you're focused on other things. Maybe your team is really, you know, prioritizing other projects. And, you know, there's some bandwidth challenges. Or maybe there's been a huge change in in, you know, what y'all are focused on. And this isn't actually as much of a priority, right? So, you know, I'm just curious what, and you can change the three reasons. But I'm just curious, you know, what is it for you and your team, I'm happy to help you move forward in whatever way make sense. If they don't respond, then, again, lead with value. You can send like we call it breakup email, but sometimes also what we were talking about earlier with, you know, this idea of really bringing in expertise, and also for me, bringing in some compassion. So one of the things I like to do is send a little bit of a pattern, disrupt email, and send something helpful, valuable educational, but not like following up for the 15th time. So even say, Hey, I saw this thought of you very specifically, for this reason, thought that you might find it valuable. Hope you all are doing okay, let me know if we can help in any way. I've had so many people being like, I'm so sorry. I know you've sent me 15 emails. We're just super busy. Thank you so much for sending this this is definitely relevant. Can we maybe catch up in a month or two, we've just been super busy.
Jonathan Fischer 43:20
Love that love that classy? Not begging, always offering value. So let's, let's close out our q&a time we got one more here, you're gonna have a this is sort of like a flash challenge here. Okay. So in our which has a talented person who seems under motivated right now like, what what the world? Can you help me in break this individual loose and get in performing?
Meghann Misiak 43:45
One, ask, there can be a lot going on. And I think when we say, you know, checked out hasn't been working hard. We don't know. And I think that, you know, also coming at it from a point of compassion, saying, Hey, so, you know, I really care about you. And I have noticed some changes and your performance and your behavior. And I really want to know what's going on so I can support you. And, you know, I'm if you have asked, I think there's also like asking a few more times. So to give you some examples of what it could be, again, we don't make assumptions. But you know, for me, being a sales trainer internally and doing sales coaching for individual salespeople that a lot of times our top performers and literally one of my clients a few years ago was like already at 300% when he came to me it could be a few things, right? It could be this person has had some things going on in their personal life, where they don't have the bandwidth where they're really struggling emotionally. And you know, that might just be a timing thing. It could be that maybe they have other things right COVID The market losing a lot of money, like it could be a lot of different things. Also, this person could be burnt out Oh, this person could be a little bit bored. And so I do think that those are three very different examples with three very different ways of handling them. But I do think that what I've been hearing personally from top salespeople, most of my clients are top performers I want to get better is a combination of one of those, I will say a lot of people are feeling less stable and secure than ever before. And it's causing a lot of overwhelm. It's causing a lot of challenges with time management with like, even just like being able to focus, because when you're stressed, when you don't feel secure, it really can impact your performance as well. So that's actually one of the biggest things that I work on. Also, I have a lot of managers actually refer me to their sales people to help people work through and right now one of the top things that a top, I would say the most consistent trainings that I do, and kind of areas of focus for me with top performers, is time management. And not only managing their time, but really figuring out how to form a better foundation of mental health of energy, and overall of wellness, so that they can actually continue to perform at peak levels.
Jonathan Fischer 46:17
Well, I love it. Well, absolute championship level answer. Thank you for that, Megan. And I want to thank you for adding so much value to our audience today. You did a fantastic job. Obviously, you have a wealth of insight to share. And I hope the listener will will pursue that further with you. Thanks for being on the show today making appreciate you.
Meghann Misiak 46:35
Thank you so much for having me. Appreciate it.
Jonathan Fischer 46:38
And we appreciate our audience. We're sponsored very proudly by overpass one of the world's best solutions for getting pre vetted talent on tap quickly if you need a team of STRS AE fullcycle people, folks, just the work the phones, you know what in the world they're doing and even fast, go to overpass.com Start your free account, check out just how easy it is to work with them over there overpass. By the way, if you've been enjoying the guests in the show, you can check out previous episodes anytime you like, by like going to our podcast, which is the evolved sales leader, anywhere you'd like to get your podcast, whether that's Apple, Google or wherever we're there, check it out, download it, use it during your workout time, your windshield time, and keep us in your world helping make you better as you grow as a sales leader. And I want to thank all of you for being here today are wonderful listeners make the show possible. Thanks for being here today. We're gonna be here at the same time. Same station next week. We'll see you then signing off. Have a great weekend, everybody.
